While I think that many of the things on this thread are funny (especally the strike out of Kalishnikov->Clipboard) I would like to remind you that such talk might be excessively Western. I would like to remind you that the Koran itself speaks of the dangers of alcohol and I don't think it a wise thing to think that you are indestructable in that you can speak of these things lightly.
Woody, do you have any idea what its like to live in Iraq nowadays? You might think our only concern is the violence but you would be wrong. Not enough qualified doctors, engineers, teachers, professors, no electricity or clean water, no infrastructure, no trustworthy police force, no concern for the environment. In the last 40 years we have lived under a dictatorship, survived 3 wars, economic sanctions and our whole social structure has changed. Don't you see? our only escape has always been our sense of humor. Now can you imagine how you would have coped in the US had the tables been turned?
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One of the troubling things in the West is that people, drunk on freedom, allow themselves to speak foolishly about their leaders, about religion and a host of other foolishnesses that you are probably already aware of. When I was an infantryman, we always spoke of the President in the most reverent of terms. Some of my fellows of education would point out something that didn't make sense in the policies and orders to our unit and the Army as a whole, but we always respected our leaders in the end.
Interesting. You fought for the right to speak your minds and now you are suggesting that its foolish to do so. And who says the current batch of Iraqi puppets are our “leaders”?
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I would point out that perhaps the best outcome for Iraq is for the current government to become stable and strong. The alternative is for another strong man to come along, or a coup by a Taliban type group, or Iraq's secular traditions being swallowed up in an Iranian type situation. That you are participating in a past-time that many silly mericans do because they have been spoiled rotten for centuries now, your situation is such that if you think that this is somehow enlightened, will make your situation better, or "what they do in the West" is improper.
We have been drinking since the days when the US was inhabited and ruled by it's indiginious people. Don't mistake Iraq for Saudi Arabia.
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That al Sadr looks like he could have a familial relationship with Rosie O'Donnel, that is funny (I think al Sadr would also find some humor in that) and good, clean fun I think.
Yes that is funny but perhaps we find the other stuff funny because our sense of humor is different to yours.
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But let's put this in perspective. Either the current installed government will work or it won't. If you don't support it and respect it, calling them monkeys and the like, you will get a government that you will respect. This is how it works in the Middle East. The question each and every one of you should be asking yourselves is what kind of government you want and be working towards it. If its Taiban, then grab your Kalishnikovs. If its Sharia and an Iranian model, then keep smiling until the Infadels leave and then fall upon the puppets and smash them. If its the Saudi model you like, then start bowing to the "monkeys" and respect them and revere them and make them into Kings. If a more Western model is desirous, then stop this foolishness of denegrating those who might end up being your saviors.
Our saviors? can you please clarify who you are referring to in this instance?
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Laugh it up now. History has taught us (in Viet Nam) that if this doesn't go through and go through quickly, that what happens is the Americans leave and all hell breaks loose, and guys like you end up dead as doornails and your families too, and the remainder will suffer under a represive probably Islamic regime until everybody gets their fill of **** each other.
I'm afraid history has taught your successive governments absolutely nothing. Thats why each country you invade turns into a bloody mess.
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You have an opportunity. Its costs the American 300 million USD a day. It keeps the various factions involved on their toes and a kind of political vaccuum from which the Iraqi citizenry can choose what it wants. Make sure that you don't turn your nose up at something that you might want long term and have it disappear on you.
Again the money issue rears its ugly head. Given you are new to posting on the IRAQI site dont you think you might appear to be somewhat insensitive to us turban heads.
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"As we are liberated from our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others" - Nelson Mandela
I could have taken a healthy dose of my own advice there and used discression instead of what I said. Strangest thing about hypocracy, when you are doing it, its very hard to catch yourself doing it until after you've said it.
About the last part there: my point is that Iraq, after the Americans bug out, are going to have either go on with the current government it has, or start afresh. The cost of going afresh is a lot of violence. To use the installed government (if its possible...it would be a first in the Middle East) would avert this difficulty. A technical point.
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