Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (Full Version)

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Lion of Babylon -> Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (5/31/2007 11:53:45 AM)

Comments please.

Baghdad (AsiaNews) – “Extremist Sunnis and Shiites in Iraq are at war over everything, but united by one common denominator: the persecution of Christians”. So say the faithful of Baghdad. A letter is circulating the capital, warning Christian women to wear the veil in accordance with domestic segregation. The letter is signed by the Mahdi army, linked to Moqtada al-Sadr, the radical Iraqi Shiite cleric, who the US considers the greatest threat to security in the country. Upon till now the Sunni group of “the Islamic State in Iraq” was the most violent threat to the Christian community: from their imposition of the jizya – the “compensation” demanded by the Koran from non Muslim subjects – to their expropriation of property and forced conversions to Islam.

Aina news agency today published an English translation of the letter. In the text the words of the martyr Mohammad Sadiq al-Sadr are underlined, when he inquired “Was the Virgin Mary (peace be upon her) unveiled so that Christian women be allowed to be unveiled? Was Fatima al-Zahra unveiled? And were the wives of the Caliphs in the First Caliphate or others unveiled? No and then no…Allah forbid and far be it from all of them”. It then warns that “In the name of the Supreme Being, She is an adulteress, and she even proclaims sinfulness, challenges and fights Allah and his Prophet and ignores and neglects religion”. In answer to the question “What measure should be taken against a woman who disobeys her father, husband, or her guardian by not committing to the legal veil?” the answer is that husbands and fathers “must guide and educate her religiously in order to convince her. If she is not convinced still, then they must imprison her at home and do not expose her to the forbidden interaction with men”. In the end it warns that “special committees have been established to follow up on this matter”. It is signed by “The People's Foundation for the Master al-Mahdi Army”.

Meanwhile messages of solidarity with Iraq’s Christians are arriving from world powers, such as Russia. the Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs has recently sent a letter to the Russian Assyrian Committee and Moscow Assyrian Ethno-Cultural Autonomy Organization, which guarantees that in Moscow’s contacts “with representatives of Iraqi authorities and international partners we delicately try to let them understand the need of ensuring conditions for preserving of original culture of Iraqi Christians, their adequate representation in Governmental structures, achievement of civil peace considering legal interests of all confessions and non-admission of discrimination of ethno-religious minorities”.

In order to bring international attention to the plight of these people in danger of extinction Ankawa.com – based in Sweden – launched a protest march to be held this afternoon in Stockholm, in which exiled Iraq Christians took part as well as other religious minorities who have fled Iraq. (MA)
 
http://www.asianews.it/index.php?l=en&art=9409&size=A 




Zeynab Hassan -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (5/31/2007 12:17:09 PM)

This is bias because I don't see anyone but Muslims, whether it be shia or suna, getting killed. I mean what is this article trying to say? That christians are being oppressed by Muslims? No way, because who is killing all the muslims in Iraq now? Ok if you say its shia vs suna..but who started the whole sectarian thing? I don't believe this.




Lion of Babylon -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/8/2007 4:43:14 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Zeynab Hassan

This is bias because I don't see anyone but Muslims, whether it be shia or suna, getting killed. I mean what is this article trying to say? That christians are being oppressed by Muslims? No way, because who is killing all the muslims in Iraq now? Ok if you say its shia vs suna..but who started the whole sectarian thing? I don't believe this.


Salam zeynab. Why is it bias? Just because Christians are not dying in their thousands does not mean that they are not being oppressed. Dont forget that the people that are forcing these caveman laws are not real muslims. They are Militias who are following the new Kuffar leaders and Mullas of Iraq. If a christian family lives in a Shia/Suni dominated areas they will naturaly be targeted by these idiots. So when you say you dont believe this, why not? It was not the Iraqi Christians who started the sectarian violence. When did you ever hear of an Iraqi Christian killing Muslims? Please explain your position so I can understand where you are coming from.




Lion of Babylon -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/8/2007 4:49:51 AM)

Here is another report from today.

Baghdad Christians threatened with tax, eviction
 
BAGHDAD -- An al Qaida-affiliated insurgent group is giving Christians in Baghdad a stark set of options: Convert to Islam, marry your daughters to our fighters, pay an Islamic tax -- or leave with only the clothes on your back. A U.S. military official said American forces became aware of the threats only last month and now have erected barriers around the largest Christian enclave in Baghdad's Dora neighborhood in an effort to protect its residents. Christians in Baghdad refuse to discuss the threats for fear of retribution. But in Syria, where thousands of Iraqi Christians have fled, tales abound of families that were killed or driven from their homes because they either refused or couldn't afford to pay the jizya, a tax usually levied on non-Muslim men of military age that's been part of Islam for more than 1,000 years.
 
"Two or three months ago, we heard we were going to be forcibly removed from Dora," said Rafah Elia Daoud, 53, who fled to Damascus, Syria's capital, on May 24. "Not everyone got a paper with the threat, but we knew. The choice was to convert, pay the jizya or get out."
 
"My brother was threatened; my sister was threatened. All of them had to pay the jizya," added her husband, Jamal Antone Karoumy, 66. "One of my brothers got a note and a single bullet under his door. The note said, 'If you don't pay the jizya to the resistance, you'll be killed.' "
 
Madeline Shukr Yusuf, 74, is still shaken by her escape to Damascus on Saturday. She said she didn't have enough money to pay a monthly jizya of 250,000 Iraqis dinars, about $200.
"They wanted to kill me and take my gold bracelets," she said, tears filling her eyes at the memory. "They tell us pay or give a daughter in marriage to a fighter."
 
Iraq long had been home to thriving Christian communities, primarily Assyrians and Chaldean Catholics, who trace their roots to ancient Mesopotamia. Some of Saddam Hussein's closest confidants were Christian, including his foreign minister, Tariq Aziz. Christian communities were prominent in many major Iraqi cities, including Mosul in the north and Basra in the south. As Iraq has descended into chaos, however, many Christians have fled, joining an estimated 2.2 million exiles, including 1.4 million Iraqis now estimated to be living in Syria. A Christian Iraqi legislator estimated Tuesday that a half-million Christians have fled Iraq since 2004.
 
"What is happening today in Iraq against Christians is shameful," Ablahad Afram Sawa said in an impassioned statement read to Iraq's parliament by its speaker. He said Christians hadn't faced such oppression in nearly 2,000 years. "Most of the churches in Baghdad have closed their doors," he said.
 
It's unclear when the Islamic State of Iraq, an insurgent umbrella group that's dominated by al-Qaida in Iraq, began demanding that Christians either leave their neighborhoods or pay the tax. A U.S. military spokesman said American troops had been aware that some Christians were being forced from their homes but realized only recently that it was a wide-scale campaign. Thousands of Iraqi Christians have flooded an industrial area on the southeast outskirts of Damascus. In apartment after ramshackle apartment, Iraqi Christians this week recounted the horror of being forced from their homes after demands for jizya -- or worse.
 
Yusuf, the 74-year-old who arrived there days ago, said her family couldn't afford the tax the insurgents demanded -- but they also couldn't afford for all the members to flee. So they bundled Yusuf into a rented car headed for the Syrian border with only a few clothes and possessions. She left behind her two daughters and her grandchildren.

http://www.sacbee.com/111/story/210821.html




azinorum -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/11/2007 3:23:52 AM)

I have to agree with Zeynab that the report is somewhat aggressive but I'm afraid that it is true. Christians in Daura are being persecuted and harassed by these dimwitted Militias who are doing their best to turn Baghdad into a living hell for anyone who doesn't adhere to their archaic beliefs.




sadiq2006 -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/11/2007 6:00:19 PM)

zeynab hassan

believe it started also 60 years from 1940's and 1950's when they kicked out the iraqi jews from iraq at that time and to destroy all their holy jews temples if do not liste nto the iraqis governments from that time it is a great example and they repeating it again in this 21 century first it was 20 century now this.




Lion of Babylon -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/11/2007 11:22:27 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sadiq2006

zeynab hassan

believe it started also 60 years from 1940's and 1950's when they kicked out the iraqi jews from iraq at that time and to destroy all their holy jews temples if do not liste nto the iraqis governments from that time it is a great example and they repeating it again in this 21 century first it was 20 century now this.


The Dude is right. The difference is that it was the Iraqi government who forced the Jews to flee from Iraq. This time its the Militias who are doing the dirty work.

** Sadiq2006 you still didnt finish our discussion on a couple of other threads on this forum.




sadiq2006 -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/12/2007 4:54:22 PM)

this is what israel did it before and they doing it again by the iraqi government again now.




Mout Ahmar -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/14/2007 10:28:26 AM)

i was always wondering what is hapening 2 iraqi christian ppl. they must be so desperat now living in this shia suni war. what can they do? were can they go? very sad 2 c iraq like this. iraq is not ready 4 freedom. forget it. [:(]




zimzim -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/20/2007 1:35:39 AM)

Hi Mout. [:)]

We are stuck. we have no place to go but to the north or to syria. Jordan they dont accept any Iraqis now so we have even less choice than before. For my family even the north is very difficult because we lived in Baghdad all our lives. The christians in the north villages are very simple ppl. Not easy to mix with if you are educated and have ambition to work and live like normal people. Most of the Christians want to leave to any place who will accept us to have at least a chance to progress ourselves and work in a normal society. I know some people will say we should remain in Iraq out of some sence of loyalty but what for? to waste our lives waiting for the suni and shia to decide they can live together? this is crazy to me. My own country do not want us so I decide I dont want them too. Sorry but this is the truth. [:(]




zimzim -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/23/2007 11:48:51 AM)

I was watching CNN today and they showed a program about the christians who are stuck in Iraq. America promised that they would take 7000 Iraqis but since april they only accepted one Iraqi. Can you believe it, one Iraqi! The Chaldean society is trying to help but it seems like they have a very dificult time convincing the us goverment to take action. More promises but nothing is hapening. No one will ever trust the USA again. They lost all their crdibility. [:'(] 




Lion of Babylon -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/25/2007 1:39:25 PM)

Hey zimo. They lost all credibility from day one. The whole occupation was a sham and nothing has changed. [8|]




YellowSunshine -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/27/2007 3:49:15 AM)

[:)]yellow, back, "feeling stronger every day" (song)...
theory hear
wrong/right? 

perhaps the muslim women perhaps again, may walk behind the man as they are so in "the spirit" .  

perhaps a veil, the veil, the covering

may be for

others

that just can't understand

or is too much for them to SEE?






YellowSunshine -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/27/2007 3:50:38 AM)

x short hear so no x to read above prior posts...
[sm=smiley27.gif]




Calm -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/27/2007 1:48:18 PM)

The christians in Iraq are being targetted by both Sunnis and Shiats, as well as the Al-Qaida and Mehdi Army.  There isn't one single church left in Baghdad without being bombed at least once, the same in Mosul, Karkuk, Basra, and other main cities.  At one time there were almost 4/5 million Iraqi Christians living in harmony with all people from whatever part of Islam or any other religion they come from.  Now there are less than 400,000.  The rest either killed, or fled to Syria, Jordan and other countries.
Only 32 Jews left in Baghdad, in 1914, there were quarter of the population of Baghdad. 
I have sent Azi a link about the Christians of Iraq, but I COULDN'T get it on this forum for some reason.
It showed the number of churches bombed, the number of priests and nuns murdered.  The number of Christian people excuted. 




Lion of Babylon -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/27/2007 1:48:54 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: YellowSunshine

[:)]yellow, back, "feeling stronger every day" (song)...
theory hear
wrong/right? 

perhaps the muslim women perhaps again, may walk behind the man as they are so in "the spirit" .  

perhaps a veil, the veil, the covering

may be for

others

that just can't understand

or is too much for them to SEE?


Hey my favorite crazy American lady is back. What happened to you, its been a while?

I hate these backward traditions. I dont care who I upset when I say that these "Hijabs" are for losers. In the arab world they've become fashion items rather than traditional garb. I've seen girls get out of cabs wearing the full monty from head to toe only to strip them off in the toilets and reveal themselves in tight jeans and make up before they go clubbing. Represive bullshit that doesnt belong in this century. [:@]




azinorum -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/27/2007 4:28:37 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Calm

The christians in Iraq are being targetted by both Sunnis and Shiats, as well as the Al-Qaida and Mehdi Army.  There isn't one single church left in Baghdad without being bombed at least once, the same in Mosul, Karkuk, Basra, and other main cities.  At one time there were almost 4/5 million Iraqi Christians living in harmony with all people from whatever part of Islam or any other religion they come from.  Now there are less than 400,000.  The rest either killed, or fled to Syria, Jordan and other countries.
Only 32 Jews left in Baghdad, in 1914, there were quarter of the population of Baghdad. 
I have sent Azi a link about the Christians of Iraq, but I COULDN'T get it on this forum for some reason.
It showed the number of churches bombed, the number of priests and nuns murdered.  The number of Christian people excuted. 


Dear Calm. I was deeply shocked and touched by the PPS you sent me. Please PM this to Harry, zimzim and all iraq4you members. God bless all the innocents that perished in these cowardly attacks and abductions. Shame on those who are responsible for these heinous acts. I was left speechless for one hour after watching the file. Words fail me at this time.




Calm -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/27/2007 4:43:56 PM)

Dear all

those who wants to see it, please send me your emails, i couldn't uploaded to iraq4u for some reason, maybe harry can.




Lion of Babylon -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/28/2007 12:19:44 AM)

Is it this one? [8|]

Tribute to the Christians of Iraq
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Syf20DKiAWw




Lion of Babylon -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/28/2007 12:58:02 AM)

Pope Benedict Concerned for Iraqi Christian
Expreses "Solidarity", Calls Their Targeted Killings "Martyrdom"

Pope Benedict on Thursday expressed deep concern for the fate of Christians in Iraq, a day after he reminded the world that helping refugees is "an obligatory gesture of human solidarity."

"Today, tragically, Christians in this region are suffering both materially and spiritually," he told the head of the Assyrian Church of the East, an independent Christian Church with members in Iraq, Lebanon, Syria, and Iran.
"Particularly in Iraq ... Christian families and communities are feeling increasing pressure from insecurity, aggression and a sense of abandonment," the Pope said.

"Many of them see no other possibility than to leave the country and seek a new future abroad. These difficulties are a source of great concern to me and I wish to express my solidarity with the pastors and the faithful of the Christian communities who remain there, often at the price of heroic sacrifices." he said.

Benedict evoked the memory of the priest and three deacons killed in Iraq on June 3, and referred to the killing of Christians in Iraq as martyrdom. "The whole church gives support to all its sons and daughters (in Iraq) with affection and admiration, and supports them in this moment of true martyrdom in the name of Christ," he said.

The pope marked World Refugee Day Wednesday by urging the necessity of protecting those who have been forced out of their homes under threat of death. At the end of his June 20 general audience, the pope spoke of the importance of international attention "toward those who are forced to flee their countries because of real dangers to their lives."
"To welcome and give hospitality to refugees is an obligatory gesture of human solidarity," the pope said, and for Christians it is "a concrete way to demonstrate Gospel love."

Urging people to ensure that refugees do not "feel isolated because of intolerance or indifference," Pope Benedict also called on governments to ensure the right to political asylum, to protect refugees and to guarantee their human rights.
Three percent of Iraq's 26 million people are Christian, with the majority being Chaldean-Assyrians and Armenians, with small numbers of Roman Catholics.




zimzim -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/28/2007 6:19:16 PM)

I am wondering why Italy don't accept more refugees. Even the pope he recognise the how we have no one to protect us in Iraq. He says this -

"To welcome and give hospitality to refugees is an obligatory gesture of human solidarity," the pope said, and for Christians it is "a concrete way to demonstrate Gospel love."

So it is time for the Italian government to do more to help us.




azinorum -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/29/2007 5:07:35 AM)

This is an issue I feel very strongly about! With the knowledge that Christians have lived in Iraq for some 2,000 years since ancient Mesopotamia what is the point of pushing out one of our greatest assets? I read somewhere that before 1990 they numbered 1 million, now the figure is closer to 400,000. Under Saddam, and as we know, some Christians rose to the top, notably Tariq Aziz, and the Baathis kept a lid on anti-Christian violence. I remember with great affection my friendships with my Iraqi Christian friends and there wasn’t one moment where we felt different from one another. Religion was never an issue and the fact that I was Muslim and they Christian was a non starter, we had better things to do with our time than discuss such futile issues.
Now most Iraqi Christians, who had lived in relative harmony with their Muslim neighbors for decades, have fled leaving a huge cultural vacuum much in the same way the Jews did when the were forced out in the 50’s and 60’s. I can’t imagine Iraq without Chaldeans, Eastern-rite Catholics, Assyrians, the descendants of the ancient empires of Assyria and Babylonia and the various other faction including Protestants. What great history and input they’ve had on our country up until recently. Without them we will be left with a Muslim only society that is by no means a true measure of what Iraq is and was. The crazy Mullahs are trying to re-write history to suite their own ends, ignoring the fact that the Koran recognizes Christianity and the second of the world’s great religions. A tragedy of epic proportions and a great loss to Iraq! You can always rely on my support, God bless you all.




zimzim -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (6/30/2007 7:08:01 AM)

Thank you Azi. I wish Iraq could be like before and we all live together in peace. I have many muslim friends, even more than christian and we never had any problems. I love them like I love my family. Some are hujab, some no, some suna, some shia. I pray for all Iraqis who are being persecuted.[sm=smiley28.gif]




Lion of Babylon -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (7/1/2007 4:05:10 PM)

Looks like youll be praying for a long time zimo. [&o]




zimzim -> RE: Mehdi Army force Christians to wear the veil (7/3/2007 2:45:24 AM)

Thanks Azi. God bless you. [:)]

LOB. I know. [:o]




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